How is the best way to work this out? For example I have a staff member who works 32 weeks per year (term time contract) 22.5 hours per week Monday to Friday. What would be her holiday entitlement?
Thanks.
Hi Eddie,
I'd suggest you first calculate a full time employee's total annual leave entitlement in hours.
Divide that figure by 52 to find the weekly entitlement.
Divide that figure by your normal full time working week hours.
Multiply that figure by 22.5 hours to find the weekly entitlement of your part time member of staff.
Multiply that figure by 32 to find the annual leave entitlement, in hours, of your part time member of staff.
That's how I did it in the past when I worked in an educational establishment, and it provided a consistent approach that could be used for all staff.
Good luck,
Owen
Illegitimi non carborundum
This scenario is covered on the DirectGov website. You can access it by clicking here. The calculation used there is different from the one put forward by owena and it may produce a different result.
semper ad meliora
I've checked through OwenA's formula and the DirectGov formula and I would say OwenA was right and the DirectGov website formula appears to be wrong.
They lay out the formula slightly differently, but are doing the same actions with one difference. OwenA suggests that you divide a full-time employee's annual leave entitlement by 52 weeks, but the DirectGov formula suggests you divide it by 52 weeks MINUS the normal annual entitlement.
In their example they use the statutory 5.6 weeks a year, so they suggest that you divide the normal, full time entitlement by 46.4 weeks. The reasoning behind this appears to be that you don't accrue annual leave while on holiday. As far as I was concerned employees do still accrue annual leave while on annual leave, just as they would service and other benefits.
The proof that this must be wrong is if you use the DirectGov formula to try and work out a full-time employee's entitlement. You should end up with the same number you started with, but this formula gives you a figure 12% higher!
Try it for yourself and you'll see: 28 days a year, divided by 46.4 weeks, multiplied by 52 weeks = 31.38 days holiday a year.
While I understand that part-time workers can be treated beneficially over a part-time worker, my understanding was that this should be done only to avoid treating them less fairly. As OwenA's formula shows they can be treated equally and correctly, so where did the government get this formula from?
Brilliant. Well spotted Adam. It would plainly be nonsense to argue that you don't accrue leave whislt on leave and there is no obvious provision for this in either the original statute, the amendments to it or any of the case law covering this issue.
If the government can't get it right on their own website, what hope do employers have!!
Adam Nuckley: I've checked through OwenA's formula and the DirectGov formula and I would say OwenA was right and the DirectGov website formula appears to be wrong. They lay out the formula slightly differently, but are doing the same actions with one difference. OwenA suggests that you divide a full-time employee's annual leave entitlement by 52 weeks, but the DirectGov formula suggests you divide it by 52 weeks MINUS the normal annual entitlement. In their example they use the statutory 5.6 weeks a year, so they suggest that you divide the normal, full time entitlement by 46.4 weeks. The reasoning behind this appears to be that you don't accrue annual leave while on holiday. As far as I was concerned employees do still accrue annual leave while on annual leave, just as they would service and other benefits. The proof that this must be wrong is if you use the DirectGov formula to try and work out a full-time employee's entitlement. You should end up with the same number you started with, but this formula gives you a figure 12% higher! Try it for yourself and you'll see: 28 days a year, divided by 46.4 weeks, multiplied by 52 weeks = 31.38 days holiday a year. While I understand that part-time workers can be treated beneficially over a part-time worker, my understanding was that this should be done only to avoid treating them less fairly. As OwenA's formula shows they can be treated equally and correctly, so where did the government get this formula from?
Sorry to re-open a year-old post but I wanted to respond to some valid points about Business Link's calculation of holiday pay for atypical workers.
I'm just as confused about this and can't believe they haven't changed the guidance if they are still wrong. The information has been the same since around 2006/7.
I've discussed this with colleagues and we came to the conclusion that the guidance didn't use 52 weeks as a denominator because an employee would have to work 52 weeks to get the full year's entitlement. They would only be entitled to their full year's holiday after the last day of december (assuming hol year is Jan-Dec).
Any thoughts?
Hi Nazia
Any calculation of annual leave entitlement needs to start with the annual entitlement - i.e. 52 weeks.
Calculating the leave entitlement of someone who has started part of the way through the leave year adds a further element to the calculations. My formula above was for the ongoing entitlement.
But if, for example, someone started exactly 26 weeks though the annual leave year, if you followed my calculation above, then divide by 52 weeks and multiply by 26 weeks, you will get what their entitlement is for the rest of that leave year.
Does that answer your question? Or have I picked you up wrong?
Best regards
Hi
Thanks for the reply.
I personally think your method is more logical and easy to understand but I was raising the point that Adam raised about dividing holiday over (52 minus holiday entitlement) rahter than over 52.
This method is from Business Link and originally Bis. Adam suggests its because they wrongly assume holiday does not accrue during holiday, my colleagues think it's because an employee does not have to work a full 52 weeks straight before they accrue the full amount of leave.
So, although I prefer your way and find it more logical, I worry that Business Link are onto something; I'm not sure which way is the right way now (bearing in mind the Business link method is more generous).
In my experience, employees don't have to work a full 52 weeks before they accrue the full amount of leave. Instead, accrual will be a matter of company policy. Some companies will only allow employees to take leave they have accrued - so new starters would be able to take 2 weeks leave in their first month. Other employers will allow that, on the condition that any 'overspend' on leave can be deducted from their final salary.
But whatever the reason, the method from Business Link to my mind cannot be right, because, as Adam rightly pointed out, if you use the their formula to try and work out a full-time employee's entitlement you should end up with the same number you started with, but their formula gives you a figure 12% higher. Not even the government can create time from nothing!
What I’ve always argued, when people query the method above that I’ve used, is that 1) it’s consistent and 2) even if it’s wrong, it’s consistently wrong, so no-one is treated less favourably…
Hope this helps
I like your justification about consistency!
Could it be that the BIS calculation is right, but only for casual workers who otherwise do not accrue holiday whilst they are on leave?
I'm not sure if I'm making any sense? I've just been getting my head in knots about term-time only workers and holidays... Maybe it will make more sense tomorrow. ..Hopefully
Have a nice evening.
Nazia: Could it be that the BIS calculation is right, but only for casual workers who otherwise do not accrue holiday whilst they are on leave?
Honestly, I don't know. It seems like an odd, and very specific, and fairly rare, set of circumstances for them to base their calculations on, rather than them look at more frequent types of part time workers.
At http://www.businesslink.gov.uk/bdotg/action/detail?itemId=1074414843&r.l1=1073858787&r.l2=1084822788&r.l3=1084822795&r.l4=1079427399&type=RESOURCES Business Link states quite clearly that 'The statutory holiday entitlement is excluded from the average working week calculations' which I have to say I don't agree with. I think the confusion is coming in with what is deemed to be a year. Business Link are calculating a working year as '52 weeks minus statutory holiday', while I just 52 weeks. Call me old-fashioned, but that's how many weeks there are in a year...!
Hi Guys I wanted to know, if we have a policy of earning one extra leave above statuutory leave every year up to 5 years i.e. a full time employee wil earn 28 days + 5 days extra once he completed 5 continous years of service with us, should the calculation with the part timers also be the same where additional 5 days leave is concerned or should that also be pro rata as how we calculate the statutory leaves?
Sorry a little off the discussion. Thanks
Shaan
shaan: should the calculation with the part timers also be the same where additional 5 days leave is concerned or should that also be pro rata as how we calculate the statutory leaves?
should the calculation with the part timers also be the same where additional 5 days leave is concerned or should that also be pro rata as how we calculate the statutory leaves?
It's both, really. It all comes down to the definition of the word 'day'.
A part timer will, after 5 years, earn another 5 days of leave. What's important is that it will be five of their days. So if they work Monday to Friday 9 to 12 (i.e. a 15 hour week) they will, for every year of service earn one of their days (i.e. 3 hours) of additional leave up to a total of 5 of their days (i.e. 15 hours).
Hope that helps
HIya, wil it be pro rata for part timers even if those additional 5 days leave is the benefit from the company? Then my argument will be should we not have every benefit for part timers pro rata?
We have not mentioned re these addiotinal leaves to be pro rata calculated in the contract for part timers meaning they will still enjoy addiotional leaves every year as full timers...
Do you think it should be corrected?
Thanks a lot!
shaan: wil it be pro rata for part timers even if those additional 5 days leave is the benefit from the company?
wil it be pro rata for part timers even if those additional 5 days leave is the benefit from the company?
Yes it will be pro-rata for the part timer - pro-rated to their days. In other words, in my exmple above their additional leave is pro-rated to one of their days, or pro-rated to 3 hours. It's the same outcome for everyone.
shaan: Then my argument will be should we not have every benefit for part timers pro rata?
Then my argument will be should we not have every benefit for part timers pro rata?
Arguably, yes. But some benefits are more difficult to pro-rata than others. That's one for an employer to decide, bearing in mind that the law states you cannot treat someone less favourably for being part time, but is silent on whether you can treat someone more favourably. E.g. Come Christmas, an employer decides to give every employee a box of chocolates. Arguably they should pro-rata that for part-timers, but are they really going to start giving out half-boxes of chocolates?
Hi Owen,
Wonder if you can offer a calculations for th efollowing scenario:
Staff are contracted for 'x' hours per week, term time only. However the hours they actually work increase in the second term (Spring) and further still in third term (Summer term) - it's childcare so numbers increase throughout the year.
Total contracted hours are calculated and paid over 12 months.
They contractually cannot take holiday during term time (like teachers) - so they 'take' their holiday entitlement during holidays.
I first thought that we could simply roll up the holiday pay in hourly wage - but this I know is illegal - even though they will not be working during holidays anyway.
So my question would be how do we a) calculate holiday entitlement on the increasing hours per term b) how would we actually pay this to employees (lump sums during holidays)?
Thanks
Spencer C
PS -
Adding confusion here - I just read rolled up hourly pay can be done as long as on pay slips it is clear between the hourly rate and the holiday rate? Is this true? if so this could be the answer!??
Hi Spencer,
For queation a):
You already know the annual contracted hours total. Divide that by 52 to find their average weekly hours.
Calculate a full time employee's total annual leave entitlement in hours.
Multiply that figure by the average weekly hours of your part time member of staff to find their weekly entitlement.
Multiply that figure by the number of weeks they work to find the annual leave entitlement, in hours, of your part time member of staff.
Given that they can't take the leave during term time, I don't think it matters that they work more hours in different terms, as long as their total amount of annual leave is correct.
For question b):
I recollect that rolled up holiday pay could be paid in Scotland and not in England (or vice versa!) with the proviso you mention. If that is still the case, it will depend on where you are based. Try Direct.gov.uk or HMRC for more advice - I've been out of the education sector for some years now.
Alternatively, lump sums during the holidays might be the most sensible option. Of course, if you're going to pay lump sums at different times, you could ask them which they'd prefer.
You'll need to bear in mind that these folk can leave part way through a year and calculating their entitlement to that date would be completely different to the above.
I am making an application for term time only work due to having two children who require childcare. I think I will be successful as I work for my local authority who have this option in my service for a few colleaguse. My question is if I work term time only, my pay is reduced & received throughout 12 months but do I accrue annual leave entitlement pro rate to my 18.5 hrs per week contract?
twigs01: do I accrue annual leave entitlement pro rate to my 18.5 hrs per week contract?
do I accrue annual leave entitlement pro rate to my 18.5 hrs per week contract?
In short, yes.
But bear in mind it won't just be pro-rata to your 18.5 hours a week but also to the number of weeks you work per year.
Some really interesting discussions here. i am currently researching (for a private school) what others do in terms of holiday for term time workers.
Would you calculate holiday for term time workers on 52 weeks or, for the weeks they actually work ie not including school holiday weeks?
Also, i understand that rolled-up holiday pay is still permitted as long as it's expressly agreed in the contract, the payslips shows basic pay and holiday pay separately, and, that holiday records are kept. If term time workers have to take holidays in school holidays, is it worth keeping records? Do you all show the holiday pay element on the payslip?
Many thanks!
Joma
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